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	<title>Comments on: Critique #95 &#8212; Chris O&#8217;Donnell</title>
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	<description>Writing and Reading. Commerce and Art. Fantasy and Science Fiction. Discuss.</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 22:07:46 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Chris O'Donnell</title>
		<link>http://www.deepgenre.com/wordpress/damon-knight/critique-95#comment-5474</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris O'Donnell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Nov 2006 19:26:22 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Kate, 
 Thank you for the advice. I already sent a second draft of this in yesterday. However after read your comments, I'm thinking of starting a whole new draft. Use the same setting but start at the beginning of their conversation instead of at the end.

Iâ€™m going to wait to see what you and others think about the second draft first. Then make any corrections before sending the newer one.

Again, thank you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kate,<br />
 Thank you for the advice. I already sent a second draft of this in yesterday. However after read your comments, I&#8217;m thinking of starting a whole new draft. Use the same setting but start at the beginning of their conversation instead of at the end.</p>
<p>Iâ€™m going to wait to see what you and others think about the second draft first. Then make any corrections before sending the newer one.</p>
<p>Again, thank you.</p>
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		<title>By: kateelliott</title>
		<link>http://www.deepgenre.com/wordpress/damon-knight/critique-95#comment-5373</link>
		<dc:creator>kateelliott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Nov 2006 22:55:19 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Chris, I'm coming in late as I have been gone for a month and not keeping up on the 13 Line openings.

I want to echo what Sherwood said.  You have a really interesting conflict, one that I personally find intriguing

Now, SLOW DOWN.

You don't need to tell me in the first page why the two characters don't trust humans, but do let me know that they don't, so I will wonder WHY they don't and what the situation is and what will happen next.

Show me the setting, the two characters, and let their interchange reveal as much of the conflict as is necessary for me to want to keep reading.

In fact, I would almost say that your opening should start about five minutes (in narrative time) before this part of the conversation.  The "Why?" could then come a page or half a page into the conversation instead of starting it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chris, I&#8217;m coming in late as I have been gone for a month and not keeping up on the 13 Line openings.</p>
<p>I want to echo what Sherwood said.  You have a really interesting conflict, one that I personally find intriguing</p>
<p>Now, SLOW DOWN.</p>
<p>You don&#8217;t need to tell me in the first page why the two characters don&#8217;t trust humans, but do let me know that they don&#8217;t, so I will wonder WHY they don&#8217;t and what the situation is and what will happen next.</p>
<p>Show me the setting, the two characters, and let their interchange reveal as much of the conflict as is necessary for me to want to keep reading.</p>
<p>In fact, I would almost say that your opening should start about five minutes (in narrative time) before this part of the conversation.  The &#8220;Why?&#8221; could then come a page or half a page into the conversation instead of starting it.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris O'Donnell</title>
		<link>http://www.deepgenre.com/wordpress/damon-knight/critique-95#comment-5363</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris O'Donnell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Nov 2006 19:09:01 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Sorry I didn't respond sooner. I'm in college right now and I had some big exams to take. 

Thank you for your comments. They were really helpful. I should be sending a revised draft soon. Hope it's better.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry I didn&#8217;t respond sooner. I&#8217;m in college right now and I had some big exams to take. </p>
<p>Thank you for your comments. They were really helpful. I should be sending a revised draft soon. Hope it&#8217;s better.</p>
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		<title>By: Sherwood Smith</title>
		<link>http://www.deepgenre.com/wordpress/damon-knight/critique-95#comment-4371</link>
		<dc:creator>Sherwood Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Nov 2006 02:29:21 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I liked the problem you set up in this story.  I thought you did a neat, swift job of setting up the two characters' dilemma: they are in a presumably direful situation in which they are forced to trust humans--knowing that humans are not to be trusted!

That said, I do hope on your next draft, you'll slip in those details that will make such a promising opening unique.  The suggestions made would help a lot with that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I liked the problem you set up in this story.  I thought you did a neat, swift job of setting up the two characters&#8217; dilemma: they are in a presumably direful situation in which they are forced to trust humans&#8211;knowing that humans are not to be trusted!</p>
<p>That said, I do hope on your next draft, you&#8217;ll slip in those details that will make such a promising opening unique.  The suggestions made would help a lot with that.</p>
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		<title>By: tchernabyelo</title>
		<link>http://www.deepgenre.com/wordpress/damon-knight/critique-95#comment-4276</link>
		<dc:creator>tchernabyelo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Nov 2006 13:45:26 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I'm afraid I must echo the above comments.   There's nothing immediately in this to make me think it's any different from a million (OK, slight exaggeration) other fantasy openings I've read.   There's no detail at all - just generic "shapeshifter", "wizard" descriptions.   I'm getting nothing visual, nothing sensory, and no real emtion either except the stock ones - weary resignation from the wise old wizard, distrust from his younger apprentice/assistant.

Talking of the wizard - whether the character's name is Grandel or Grandle (you use both), it struck me as too reminiscent of Grendel, though there's no obvious similiarity of characteristics.

I'm sorry, but I wouldn't turn the page.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m afraid I must echo the above comments.   There&#8217;s nothing immediately in this to make me think it&#8217;s any different from a million (OK, slight exaggeration) other fantasy openings I&#8217;ve read.   There&#8217;s no detail at all - just generic &#8220;shapeshifter&#8221;, &#8220;wizard&#8221; descriptions.   I&#8217;m getting nothing visual, nothing sensory, and no real emtion either except the stock ones - weary resignation from the wise old wizard, distrust from his younger apprentice/assistant.</p>
<p>Talking of the wizard - whether the character&#8217;s name is Grandel or Grandle (you use both), it struck me as too reminiscent of Grendel, though there&#8217;s no obvious similiarity of characteristics.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sorry, but I wouldn&#8217;t turn the page.</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin Andrew Murphy</title>
		<link>http://www.deepgenre.com/wordpress/damon-knight/critique-95#comment-4199</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin Andrew Murphy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Nov 2006 23:52:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.deepgenre.com/wordpress/damon-knight/critique-95/#comment-4199</guid>
		<description>Chris,

Well, the last line should have a "the" before "traitorous," but apart from that, the grammar is fine.

What isn't fine is the storytelling.  This reads a lot like a gaming transcript, where it's assumes that everyone knows the classes and races and so on.  We've got a shapeshifter, we've got a mentor/wizard of unspecified (but presumably not human) race and so on.

The trouble is that, for fantasy fiction, human is the new "white."  We assume that our protagonists are human unless told otherwise, and if told otherwise, we expect to be told more.  Yes, it's rather ethnocentric, but people are ethnocentric because it gives a frame of reference.  If you start a story with "Bob was not white" the reader then gathers that A). Race is an issue in this story, and B). the author better tell us what race Bob is so we have some chance of picturing him as something other than "nebulous non-caucasian male."

Is a shapeshifter a werewolf?  A creature that can take any form? A what?  Is the mentor a three-toed purple sloth beast?

Most of this could be solved with description and an opening that is something other than "As you know, Bob."  Maybe a brief recap of the human perfidy that has the shapeshifter so upset lo these many years later.

Anyway, the current form of the story isn't inducing me to turn the page, not because of the basic problem, but because of the prose and dialogue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chris,</p>
<p>Well, the last line should have a &#8220;the&#8221; before &#8220;traitorous,&#8221; but apart from that, the grammar is fine.</p>
<p>What isn&#8217;t fine is the storytelling.  This reads a lot like a gaming transcript, where it&#8217;s assumes that everyone knows the classes and races and so on.  We&#8217;ve got a shapeshifter, we&#8217;ve got a mentor/wizard of unspecified (but presumably not human) race and so on.</p>
<p>The trouble is that, for fantasy fiction, human is the new &#8220;white.&#8221;  We assume that our protagonists are human unless told otherwise, and if told otherwise, we expect to be told more.  Yes, it&#8217;s rather ethnocentric, but people are ethnocentric because it gives a frame of reference.  If you start a story with &#8220;Bob was not white&#8221; the reader then gathers that A). Race is an issue in this story, and B). the author better tell us what race Bob is so we have some chance of picturing him as something other than &#8220;nebulous non-caucasian male.&#8221;</p>
<p>Is a shapeshifter a werewolf?  A creature that can take any form? A what?  Is the mentor a three-toed purple sloth beast?</p>
<p>Most of this could be solved with description and an opening that is something other than &#8220;As you know, Bob.&#8221;  Maybe a brief recap of the human perfidy that has the shapeshifter so upset lo these many years later.</p>
<p>Anyway, the current form of the story isn&#8217;t inducing me to turn the page, not because of the basic problem, but because of the prose and dialogue.</p>
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